Thursday, 15 December 2011

  • I Like You As A Friend, Just Not As A Parent

    I have a friend with whom I used to be very close.  We spent a lot of time together since she only lived 10 minutes from my house.  She is about 4 years older than me and married.  She and her husband had been trying to conceive for many years, but at that time, they still had no children.

    In the past few years, our lives took us different directions and I moved to another town about 2 hours away from her.  Cell phone reception is bad on my end and she's not very fond of talking on the phone anyway; likewise with emailing.  So we don't get to see each other very much anymore, but whenever I travel, I try to work it out so I can stop by and visit her when I pass through her city.  She and her husband share 1 car and it's not usually an option for her to meet us somewhere, we just have to come to her house.

    At any rate, she now has a 3-yr-old daughter and I have a daughter that's not quite 2.  On one of those passing-through visits (the girls were more like 2 1/2 and 15 months at the time), I had allotted several hours to spend with her at her house, hoping our daughters would play well together and she and I could do some catching up.  As we talked and the kids played, I noticed her daughter was picking up every toy that mine put down and placing it up high, where my daughter wouldn't be able to reach it anymore.  Soon there were no more toys left within my daughter's reach.  I pointed it out to my friend and she just laughed, as if it were really funny, and did nothing about it.  Then my daughter saw a baby doll in a stroller that was out of her reach and started saying, "Baby, baby."  She was (and still is) in a phase where she LOVES baby dolls and playing "mommy"!  I asked my friend's daughter if mine could play with her baby doll.  She wouldn't answer me; she is pretty shy with people she doesn't know.  And her mom directed her to say one of these two options:  "Sure," OR, "I'd rather she didn't."  And guess which one she chose to say?  Since my daughter, being 15 months, didn't really understand what was going on, my friend recommended to the 2 1/2 year old that they put her dolls and stroller in the bedroom and shut the door so my child couldn't get to them.

    I've been pretty at a loss as to how to handle this situation.  The truth is, my friend and I have very different approaches to parenthood and I don't care for her parenting style very much.  I'm not saying one is right and one is wrong, just that I don't know how - or if - I can find a happy medium.  If the tables had been turned, I would have handled my daughter very differently.  I want my child to learn to share, and to learn to take care of others - especially children that are younger than her.  From things I'm reading, 2 1/2 yrs old is old enough to start learning how to share and take turns. 

    I know the whole thing isn't going to go perfectly, but in my opinion, it would have been a good opportunity since you have to start somewhere.  I would understand if my kid was going after a toy that had some very special significance to her, but the other child didn't want to share anything at all and her mother encouraged her to be selfish.

    Since I don't see this person very often, maybe it's not worth doing anything about.  But I don't feel like it's right to just write her out of my life.

    What should I do?  Am I making a big deal over nothing?

Comments (27)

  • drawmafreezone@xanga

    I think the only good time to express opinions on a friends parenting style is if they ask for that opinion. Otherwise they probably don't want and most likely won't appreciate the advice.

  • bebe_nxnx@xanga
    I think what your friend did is downright rude. But maybe its cuz she thought that you girls are pretty close and maybe she figured that you would just understand. You mentioned that ur friend's kid is in her two's... Thats actually a tough age... Terrible twos and threes.. Maybe behind closed doors, ur mommy friend is having a hard time dealing with her daughter... Perhaps, its not the first time she saw her daughter do this and she doesn't want to deal with it while you were there... probably too embarassed.. You see, as a parent myself, I don't believe that any parent is capable of mistreating other people's kids unless they have issues of their own... It's really not ur job to understand her but dont take it as a personal attack against you... and also, no matter what, dont make ur child feel like that someone is making a personal attack to them. At least for you, its a learning experience and in my opinion its also good to learn from other people's mistakes. I'm sure that your friend is someone special to you cuz why would you even bother going to her, right? Maybe on your next visit, your daughter can bring a toy and she could share it. Thats pretty much the only thing you can do cuz in my experience, no parent wants to be confronted about their parenting style especially when theyre having a hard time. My friend's daughter used to hit my son so much when he was one yr old (shes 9 months older)... I couldnt get mad of course at the kid but instead whenever she did it I say, Do you wanna say something? Use your words... Use your gentle touch... eventually she stopped

    So yeah!! Hope you feel better reading this! Take care!!
  • XoGingerSnapps@xanga

    I don't think i would tell her what to do, obviously lol it is her child. But what kind of friend is it if you can't express yourself? i think it would be completely appropriate for you to discuss what happened. But i wouldn't tell her how to parent her child. Just say you didn't like how the little girl treated yours. If she doesn't want to make it a requirement to share, then she should have told you, and next time bring your daughter her own toys. And they can each play with their own. I don't think its such a big deal. Everyone can parent the way they want. It isn't your responsibility to tell her she is doing it wrong. Just say i would have appreciated a warning so i could have brought toys for my daughter. 

  • mommalosingit@xanga

    In my opinion that child is a toddler and toddlers are "all about me"

  • phoebester@xanga

    I think maybe you're being a smidge sensitive. I can understand being angry when you see your child being deprived- even in a very minor fashion- through the actions of others.... believe me I do understand that. I'm a mom.


    Still, try to see it from the other woman's point of view. 15-month-olds can be VERY destructive towards objects. If she made her 2-and-a-half-year-old daughter share her toys with your daughter, and your daughter had ended up breaking a toy or the baby doll (a very large possibility for any object put into the tiny hands of a toddler) ... that would have created some nasty trust issues between your friend and her daughter. "I can't trust Mommy when she tells me to share because it will always end badly for me when I obey." I can see your friend being wary of creating a bad psychological situation this way. Putting her daughter's baby doll in another room so your daughter would forget about the toy seems pretty reasonable in my opinion. My outrage meter isn't ticking high over this.


    If your friend had yelled at your daughter, slapped her or allowed a pothead neighbor to babysit then yeah, ... cut off relations. This situation though... nah. Agree to disagree and move on. This is not something worth breaking a friendship.


    My two cents.

  • Miss_AnH@xanga

    I agree with you; If it were my child, I would teach her to share her toys and if it were my friend, i would've just blurted out "Oh, she hasn't learned how to share  yet?" in a positive tone.


    If her daughter didn't want the baby to play with the doll it's understandable but you're friend should have asked her daughter to get something else for the baby to play with. She was rude. I feel as if she's enabling a spoiled brat.


    Everyone's parenting style is each his own but don't end a friendship over it. Next time just bring a few toys of your own. I would honestly would like to see how your friend would react if the baby didn't share with her daughter.

  • wretched_epiphany@xanga

    Considering you don't see this friend often, you will probably rarely have issues like this.  However, if you criticize her parenting style...you may lose her as a friend completely.  I would say just do your best to ignore it unless it escalates to her child being physically abusive and your friend reacts the same way.

    However, if she were a neighbor/ someone you saw often...I would be more inclined to mention it as gently as possible.

  • Whatsthat

    People get weird when it comes to their children sometimes and can be short-sited and selfish. Not just your friend, I've seen it many times (mothers especially).
    I wouldn't break off the friendship because it's such a long distance one anyway. Don't be afraid to say something though...just because you speak up doesn't mean it will result in a fight or your friend disliking you.
    If you ever go visit her again, bring plenty of your own child's toys. That should probably be a rule of thumb anywhere you go anyway. Always bring stuff to entertain your own child just in case the circumstances you put them in don't have any. 

  • LadyGwenivere@xanga

    It sounds like your friend's daughter has some sharing issues...
    But in all honesty, if her daughter did not want your daughter to play with the baby/stroller, then the mom did the right thing by putting it away.
    We have toys like that in our house, and when other children come over those toys get put away.
    I wouldn't take it too personally, and I would not let this ruin your friendship. Chances are both kids forgot about it pretty quickly anyway.
    I have a friend like this as well, and I always bring toys for my kids when we go visit. After a couple of visits I did end up talking to her about what what going on... Her son was constantly taking toys from mine.. And I said right out to him "Its hard to learn to share, but it so much more fun to play with friends when we do!" (mine was 3 and her son was almost 4). So we sat on the floor for like 2 hours and talked about sharing. It turns out that when my friend was growing up she had nothing that was just "her's",  with 5 sisters they had to share everything all the time. She did not want her son feeling the same way. So now, he does have special toys that get put away when friends come, but he has come a heck of a long way when it comes to sharing.

  • WaitingToShrug@xanga

    I'm just kind of curious about why you're still her friend. I mean, she won't make an effort to stay in touch with you, she doesn't sound like she's that involved in your friendship.

  • quidam2010@xanga

    @ everyone -thank you for your comments!  I think the idea of bringing our own toys for my daughter is a great one and I will make sure to do so.  I think we may even have had toys in the car (I never travel with my young one w/ out bringing things to keep her entertained), I think I probably just overlooked the concept of going to the car to get something for her.  Blonde moment!  

    I appreciate all of your thoughts!

  • quidam2010@xanga

    @WaitingToShrug@xanga - that's a really good question and worth thinking about.  The truth is, I probably feel some small sense of obligation to my friend.  She helped me through a really rough time when I lived in the same city as her, and went the extra mile to be there for me.  So now that we don't stay in touch as often and she's gotten really wrapped up in her family (which is understandable), I feel like I could/should at least make some effort to talk to her and/or visit her when I can. It feels like if I just dumped her once things got better for me, that that would mean I was just using her when things got rough.  Which is not at all what my heart is toward her but maybe you can see what I mean.  At any rate, we're not in touch very often but I do want to try to help our visits be as peaceful and enjoyable as possible since they are so few and far between.  I'm sure (or I hope???) it will get better as our kids get older.  The 3-yr-old has a baby sister now, so she may end up having to learn to share whether she likes it or not! 

  • LadyGwenivere@xanga

    @quidam2010@xanga - I was in your friend's position... and on her behalf I want to thank you for not just dropping her. I wasn't so lucky.. I went through a lot with a friend, and when I moved back to town we started hanging out again. Unfortunately, she hated that I am a foster parent, and told me to my face I had no business taking other people's babies, that I should just have one of my own. Thats the last time she spoke to me.
    So thank you for being a real friend and sticking it out.

  • iones_island@xanga

    there are some details that seem to be missing here. did you bring toys for your child or were all of these toys the property of the older kid?


    concerning putting the toys out of reach, yeah, that was rude of the kid, but guess what, they're a kid. what did you do about it other than point it out to your friend? did you give any of the toys back to your child and ask that she be a polite host? the doll is a separate issue and frankly that bit sounds immature and childish on your part. for all you(or at least we your readers) know that doll is a prized possession and you think it's rude that your friend let her child decide whether she wanted to share it or not? yes, sharing is good, but it's also OK to have boundaries regarding our property. If I own something then I have the right to decide whether or not I share it, that's another lesson you should teach your kid. 
  • Megabyyte@xanga

     Maybe it's just me, but I don't see why you should have to bring toys with you. One would think that if you both have kids, and you'll be at her house, she could share her toys. Like you said, that was a good opportunity for her to learn how to share. I know kids aren't great about sharing, but they need to learn. Period. If my daughter has friends over, I don't expect them to cart over a bunch of toys so my daughter can be selfish with hers. that's just ridiculous. She shares. She doesn't always like it, but tough. lol

  • Alle_in_Ashe@xanga

    My daughter just turned 3 and i have a friend and her daughter is nearly 4. We play together at least once a week.  I use her daughter as a kind of guide. "In six months, i should probably be prepared for *insert behavior here*" because my daughter typically grows right into stages as friend's daughter grows out of them.

    the picking up toys and putting them out of reach stage, i remember that one. Friend's daughter went through it first. We, as parents, do it constantly. We pick up stuff the children want to play with and place it out of reach. So when a smaller child comes by, the older child (especially if there are no other children in the house) may take on a "parental like" role and start picking things up and putting them out of reach. it doesn't matter that they are toys.So, that's a fairly common thing. 
    We discuss and work on sharing an aweful lot.But your friend gave her child the option of saying that she'd rather not share, and truthfuly, i commend that. While we should encourage our children to share their toys, they should share their toys because they want to share their toys not because we are forcing them to.  
    No one, and i mean NO ONE forces me to share something of mine. I share because i want to share. I don't understand why some people expect children to just share freely and then can't understand why they're angry about it.
    It's possible that you need to talk with your friend and ask her why she parents the way she parents. because all children are different. Even if you wouldn't parent your child that way- understanding her reasoning behind it (even if it makes no sense to you) can help you in situations like that. you might could use it as a teachable moment for your child.
  • SHEERROSE@xanga

    @Alle_in_Ashe@xanga - I think this explains it perfectly! I second what she said.

  • nachita86@xanga

    I don't get the whole sharing thing. I think in daycare or school settings, yes, sharing is a must because those toys and supplies are community property. But I would not expect my child to share his own toys. I don't go around sharing my computer and my iPod, so I don't expect the same thing of him. It's his stuff, if he doesn't want to share, that's perfectly fine.

  • artist3@xanga

    @nachita86@xanga -   Its called having courtesy, and being nice. While growing up I was taught to share with people that didn't have cause it was the nice thing to do, especially when I am just letting them use for time being in my home. I mean it wont hurt your child to let someone use/play with something of theirs, especially when they are not using it, but if you want to raise a stingy brat that is cool too.

  • nachita86@xanga

    @artist3@xanga - Hey, courtesy goes both ways. I was always taught not to mess with other people's stuff. I was taught that if another person did not want to share his/her stuff with me, that I should respect his/her wishes and property. I think it's unfair that adults expect little kids to share so much, when you never see adults frequently engaging in that type of behavior. How would you feel if a co-worker just picked up your brand new iPhone and started messing with it, and when you ask for it back, your mom pops in and says, "Hey, now! You better share your iPhone with Billy!" Get serious.

    It's another thing entirely if a person offers up their belongings to be borrowed by other people. But little kids don't work that way. They see, they take. No one likes to see their personal belongings snatched up by other people.

  • artist3@xanga

    @nachita86@xanga - Maybe the people your hang around don't share things, but I know me and my friends do share things whether it be money if they need, food,car ride, etc.. And I wasn't calling for people to give up their prized personal possessions or things that they are currently using. Another thing, I dont even understand the situation you proposed, sharing with anybody usually goes like this,person A has something,  person B that wants/needs said thing asks(politely) to use the thing, person A then shares or not upon discretion. The situation you described sounds more like stealing and I would agree that nobody likes that. I dont know how your statement relates to what blogger said, what she described was she went to her friends house with her daughter. The two adults wanted to have time to themselves and sat their daughters down to play 

    together

    . And now we find ourselves at the disagreeing point, I see the situation as both the girls being at a pretty non communication age, would need their mothers to show them the right way to do things( I feel right thing would be, if you have a guest you should show hospitality and share your stuff with

    discretion

    , you feel people dont have to share if they don't want to, which comes off as stingy).

     

    I am sure when you invite your friends w/children over, and you sit them down to play together  you don't just let your son use all their own things and leave the other child not entertained, but maybe you do since you don't teach your kid that in

    some situations

    sharing is the right thing to do.

      
  • the_rocking_of_socks@xanga

    It sounds like your friend's kid just hasn't had a lot of exposure to other children.  It's natural for kids to be stingy with their toys if they haven't learned how to share yet.  And your friend probably thought that she was fixing the problem by eliminating the toys altogether.  I don't think she was purposely encouraging selfishness.


    If you see it happening again, try getting down in the floor and playing with the kids, too.  Engage them, show them how to share and how to play together nicely, and hopefully both the kids and your friend will get the message.
  • youngvan@xanga

    @Alle_in_Ashe@xanga - Exactly what I was thinking. Because the older child picked up the toys AFTER the younger child put it down. Even if she is annoyed her toys are being played with, she waited it out and then cleaned it up. That, and I think as parents we should give our children a choice in some matters. Great comment!

  • written_conversations@xanga

    why should children be expected to share when adults rarely do the same?

  • quidam2010@xanga

    Hey everybody, you all have some great thoughts and I really appreciate the comments.

    I didn't even realize that I left an important detail out of this entirely, and that detail is this:  both my friend and I are religious/spiritual people.  We believe in God and are professing Christians, and we have talked about it extensively throughout the course of our relationship.  Our beliefs would generally mean that we desire to teach our children to approach others with love and that would include sharing toys.  We even had theoretical discussions about that before either of us had babies.  Now, I totally understand that a 2.5 yr-old child is just at the very beginning stages of learning these types of things.  But like I said, you have to start somewhere and I felt it could have been a great learning opportunity.  This is a big part of why my friend's lack of response to her daughter was confusing to me. 

    I don't want to make this comment thread hairy, so please don't take offense to the above.  Whatever your beliefs are, it's cool, and there's no judgment intended if you have a different opinion or feel a different way is best for you.  This is also not meant to imply that just because you have certain beliefs that it means you must be a doormat or let someone else walk all over you.  Not what I mean either. 

    I just realized this morning that I had left out that bit of information so, of course, it would be confusing as to why I seem to expect a specific thing from my friend.

    All in all I do appreciate your thoughts and will plan ahead next time to try out some of these suggestions.

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